Unlocking Healthy Relationships

Sharon Costanzo

[00:00:00] Ed Watters: To overcome, you must educate. Educate not only yourself, but educate anyone seeking to learn. We are all Dead America, we can all learn something. To learn, we must challenge what we already understand. The way we do that is through conversation. Sometimes we have conversations with others, however, some of the best conversations happen with ourselves. Reach out and challenge yourself; let’s dive in and learn something new right now.

[00:00:55] Today we are speaking with Sharon Costanzo. She is a relationship coach, a podcast host, her podcast, Respected and Connected. Sharon, could you please introduce yourself and let people know just a little more about you, please?

[00:01:12] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah. So I, um, I started my podcast several years ago, several, three and a half years ago, which seems like a lifetime ago now. So much has happened in the last three and a half years, just in our world. And, um, but you know, when I started my relationship coaching business and then my podcast, I felt like there was this kind of gap in the way that we talk about relationships. And there’s a lot of, kind of chatter about, well, there’s nothing you can really do if you’re in a relationship with someone and the relationship is difficult.

[00:01:50] There’s not really much choice you have, you can either just put up with it and deal with it, or you can walk away from the relationship. That’s what I was seeing. I was struggling in, with some issues in my own relationship and trying to get help, um, with traditional couples counseling and I was kind of feeling the same, same way.

[00:02:11] There were some difficulties in my relationship that I felt like were really intolerable. Um, nothing to the extent of, you know, the big, the big things that we hear about, you know, infidelity, or abuse, or addiction. None of those things were really the big challenge in our relationship, but we just weren’t seeing eye to eye.

[00:02:29] We weren’t working through things the way that I thought was satisfactory and going to a couple’s counselor wasn’t really helping. We were just kind of smoothing things over, not really getting to the heart of the issue, and not really learning how to address our differences in a way that felt really respectful and kind to both of us.

[00:02:54] Um, I feel like there is, there’s a lot of, kind of chatter in, in our culture about, [00:03:00] you know, either women need to be really passive and accommodating, or they can be kind of little feisty bitches. Like, there’s no middle ground here in what people can do when they’re not happy in their relationships.

[00:03:12] And so figuring, figuring some of those things out, kind of challenging some norms, learning some different tools for communicating, for resolving conflict, all of that really became the foundation of my work and what I help individuals and couples with. Kind of that, you know, not going to either one of those extremes, but how can we really find some middle ground and land in a place where we both feel like we have a voice in the relationship and we both feel really valued and, and seen within our relationships.

[00:03:54] Ed Watters: Yeah, I appreciate that a lot. Relationship is the key to everything. And the big thing is communication. If you cannot communicate effectively, your relationship will not be effective so we have to remember that. Yes, you have to, like you stated, challenge the norms, the traditions of our society.

[00:04:20] On my research, I noticed you came up Mormon. And that, that can really affect a lot of relationships in many ways when we put our relationship below our relationship with our religion. And, you know, now, now many people get that mixed up because there’s a relationship with God and then there’s a relationship with the church.

[00:04:51] And it’s totally different. And many people run from God because of the implications coming from the church. And I find that disturbing in so many ways, it causes divorce and I am so against that. I’ve went, I came up Mormon. I was raised Mormon so I know the values within the religion. And I do not mock any religion at all, I, I think religion is necessary. And I, I really want to start there with our conversation because I’m interested in what your take is on religion within your relationship.

[00:05:36] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah. Well, and that’s a great question and nobody has really ever asked me that directly before. I, I, I’ve kind of talked about it a little bit, but, but, um, I was twenty-seven when I got married. I have talked about that part, which is pretty old for a Mormon girl growing up in the nineties. Um, I always thought I would get married when I was twenty, like my mom [00:06:00] did and my grandma did, you know? I would just go straight from my parents home into my, my husband’s home and, and that’s just not the way it worked out for me.

[00:06:09] I, I, I studied engineering in school, so I have two engineering degrees. And what I have shared before is, as soon as I, as soon as people saw, oh, she’s going to college to like have a career and a profession, not just to find a husband, my dating prospects really shrunk dramatically. Um, and by the time I graduated with my master’s degree

[00:06:33] and purchased my own home, I just remember I went on a lot of first dates and not very many second dates because most of the, the LDS Mormon guys I was, I was surrounded by just weren’t looking for a woman like me. And I ended up meeting my husband at work. And he’s not an active member of the LDS church, which was kind of something that we, you know, kind of were, we were interested in each other

[00:07:01] and it was like, Oh, how does this work? The Mormon church really teaches very strongly to marry somebody who’s also active in the church and believes the same as you. And you get married in the temple and you have this, this ideal, what we call a celestial marriage. Um, but I was like, I really want to get married and I really want to have a family.

[00:07:23] The guys who are interested in me, I’m, I’m not interested in. The guys who I’m interested in, aren’t interested in me. Here’s this other choice, um, with my husband. And I, I felt strongly that, that God blessed that choice for me to kind of not follow the Mormon script and get married in the temple. So we got married, I was twenty-seven, he was twenty-nine, and, and we started our family. And I think because I started my marriage knowing that it was going to be different than what the church taught, and knowing and having this conviction that it was going to be okay regardless, my husband and I have always been very respectful of each other

[00:08:11] in our differences and how we, you know, practice our faith. My husband’s not really a religious person in any way. I still attend the LDS church, um, and I, I said this recently to some people in my family, the reasons why I go to church are much different than a lot of the reasons why most of the people I go to church with go to church. Um, but my kids are eight and nine and they attend church with me. So for me, in my relationship, that is one of the ways where I kind of have challenged the norms, I guess you could say. And, um, and I do, I feel strongly that, that God is okay with that. That God, you know, the, the reason for religion [00:09:00] is not to check all of the boxes so that we can get back to God,

[00:09:04] it’s to provide some structure and community and a set of shared moral values. And my husband has also been really respectful of me and my decisions to go to church. You know, we don’t fight each other on that issue. He doesn’t say, Oh, I really think you should stay home today. I really don’t think you should make the kids go.

[00:09:26] And I also don’t say, I really think you should be at church with us. You know, that’s just not part of how our relationship works. You know, and of course, like I said, we’ve been to therapy and counseling for many other issues in our marriage, but our religious differences have not been an issue for us.

[00:09:48] Ed Watters: That’s really good to hear. You know, because we are created in the image of God. And we’ve got to remember that God tells us to come before the bold, excuse me, come before the throne boldly and that’s when you’re going to get heard. And men were created in the image of God, but woman was also created in the image of God and that applies to them also. So what is bound above is bound below and those same principles apply. So when we are not willing to listen to our wife, we’re not listening to what is commanded of us by God. And it’s important that we understand that as men, because so many men want to harness a woman. And the intelligence of a woman is so needed in our world.

[00:10:53] And our relationship as man and woman, I feel, is a combined effort. It’s not 50/50, it’s not 60/40, it is definitely, the day will tell you what you need to provide for the day. And that’s how you live day to day. And accept that, hey, if my wife can provide this service, sometimes even better than I, why should I complain about that?

[00:11:27] I’m all in. And the role of a husband is not only to protect, it’s to provide that moral support that a wife needs to know who she is, understand her wants, her needs, so she can come and boldly present them to her husband. Where it’s not a complaint, it’s not crying to, it is actually, Hey, I have this issue and [00:12:00] we need to address it.

[00:12:01] That is perfect communication. And it should never turn into hostilities, which so many men want to turn it into. This is big what you’re talking about in your line of, uh, exploration, if you will. It’s important that we have women out there providing context for other young women to follow. It’s not a fight between men and women. It’s really about building each other up and providing for each other. We’re helpers, right?

[00:12:45] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah, yeah. And I love that you pointed, pointed that out. And that kind of point of, Gottman calls it accepting your spouse’s influence. You know, it’s one of the seven principles, the seven core principles of having a healthy relationship. And, and when I read that book, The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work, I remember seeing that. Um, that’s that, you know, that principle accepting influence. And one of the observations that Gottman has made in his forty plus years of studying relationships is that about two thirds of men really struggle to receive influence from their female partners.

[00:13:27] And it’s destructive in the relationship when they can’t, you know, we kind of have that, that, still what I would call old fashioned view of, you know, the man is the decider. It really is destructive in our relationships when men can’t receive influence. And I think also women do a disservice to the relationship when they hesitate to bring up issues and try and have them resolved. You know, I say it’s your job also as a woman to be an influential force in the relationship, to not be a passive participant in your relationship, to be, you know, just like you’re saying, to be bold and influential and decide what’s important to you and really advocate for it. Because you, by you doing that, and you kind of maybe pressuring the system, if it needs to be pressured, providing that, that pressure and say, Hey, we really need to address this.

[00:14:27] That’s how you grow and that’s how we kind of overcome this, this big issue that we have within our society and within our homes of people not being able to navigate tough issues and resolve conflict and really create something better than what the status quo is offering to us right now.

[00:14:51] Ed Watters: Yeah, that’s very huge. So, you know, a big thing about [00:15:00] fixing us is understanding who we are, and we oftentimes look externally for the answers that we need. However, many times we figure out in the long haul that the answers are inside of us. And it’s, we are afraid to ask those questions to ourselves to resolve those underlying issues. And I really think that that is kind of interesting that we don’t allow ourselves to be critical of ourselves enough. What do you think about that?

[00:15:42] Sharon Costanzo: I think that it’s, it is, it’s really difficult to see kind of that shadow part of who we are. You know, it’s difficult to see how we kind of can so easily deceive and justify ourselves in some of the ways that we’re, we’re showing up in the world and, and not being really fair and kind to the people that we care about. Um, I think that it takes a lot of maturity and self compassion to really be able to see kind of that darker part of our true nature.

[00:16:24] Ed Watters: Yeah, I agree a lot. So, with that being said, we see a lot of men’s groups and women’s groups to find out who we truly are. But we don’t see a lot of couples groups. And I think moving beyond the separation between manhood and womanhood, I believe that if you are in a relationship, you should already be beyond the, who a woman is and who a man is, and you should move into what a couple is. And this brings us meaningful answers to many questions that couples have that, it’s hard to find those answers for. And I’m not against a man’s group or a woman’s group, I think those also play a critical role in our lives. But I think that it’s also equally important to find other couples that bear our own morals, our own ethics, and we should group up with those so we can embody the spirit of relationship. What’s your thoughts on that?

[00:17:48] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah, I totally agree with that. And I remember, so, you know, like I said, I have, I have two engineering degrees. I worked for the utility company for about nine years here in [00:18:00] Utah. And it was a very, for me, it was a very toxic, oppressive environment. Um, very traditional old school men running everything, very stark gender bias. I, you know, I had a group of women at work that we kind of all banded together and we were moral support for each other.

[00:18:21] None of us work there anymore, but I remember they were starting this, um, like women’s support group and it was balanced with men and women. And, and I, you know, I kind of raised my hand in one of the meetings and I said, Men and women in this company are having very different experiences at work. What are we going to do about it? And one of the guys in the group was very wise, you know, and he said, We need to be having more shared experiences. Which is exactly what you’re talking about. And that is one of the things that has kind of evolved in my business as well. You know, I used to speak very directly to women, all the time to women.

[00:19:03] And, um, just in the last couple of years, I’ve been, you know, attending local networking groups and, and there’s, there’s often almost always just as many men as women in those groups. And, and I was having men come up to me and ask me, you know, just really tender, heartfelt questions about things that were coming up in their relationships that they didn’t have a really, platform to do, to ask those types of questions.

[00:19:30] And, and I thought, and I just started having people more, reach out to me in that way. So I, I started hosting a monthly couples group for couples to start exploring some of those things. Because it’s just like you said, you know, there’s, there are some things that are unique for many men in relationships and unique for many men, women in relationships. But the opposite is also true, you know, there are things that women are feeling that they don’t realize men are feeling also. There’s things that men are feeling that they, they don’t recognize that women also feel. And until we really get people in the same room and provide a, a container where it’s safe to explore some of those things and, and be vulnerable and, and share what your experience is like,

[00:20:23] it’s, it’s so powerful I think as a man or a woman to be in that room and to hear, and, you know, if you’re a woman, to hear another man speak, that’s not your husband, you know, that you don’t have all of that baggage with, to hear them speak openly and vulnerable and vulnerably can really help you to see your own partner in a different light. To have a more warm and compassionate view of what they’re doing that makes your life challenging and to see it from a different perspective. Just, it makes all the difference [00:21:00] to, to provide a little bit more kind of care, and compassion, and room to explore some of those things.

[00:21:07] Ed Watters: Yes, that’s well put. Uh, some of the best advice I ever received is, early on in our relationship, when I reached out, one of the first times for counseling, our counselor pointed us at Gary Smalley, and he’s a relationship coach, way back old school. And he told us, Men and women are different. We think different, we act different, we’re different. And sometimes when we come together in a relationship, we forget that we’re different. And we really have to be in tune with that at all times because we are different, we think different, we act different. And we should be different, it’s the beautiful thing about every relationship. Not just man and woman, any relationship.

[00:22:12] We’re different and we should respect that difference. It doesn’t have to be annoying, you have to just own up that we’re different. And then the respect of the difference is really a beautiful thing when we actually think about that. And when we tolerate each other because we are different, we learn different mannerisms to interact with each other because the communication will get better. We evolve in other words. So what’s your thought on that?

[00:22:55] Sharon Costanzo: Um, yeah. I think often when we’re kind of in our, whether it’s like an earlier developmental phase, or we just haven’t outgrown that fear of being different, it can feel really disruptive. You know, I think, uh, one of the things that Terry Real says often about relationships is, we marry our partner because they’re familiar enough to us. They remind us of something from our childhood, you know, they’re enough like our mom and dad that, that we can accept it. But they’re different enough that we think, Oh, this is my opportunity to, to heal some part of myself that didn’t get healed as a child. And we start pulling at that like, Oh, here, you need to be this way to make me feel better about

[00:23:42] some unresolved part of, of my history. And really the opportunity, and I found this to be especially true in my relationship. And I’m a, I don’t think I’m unique in that way. But some of the things that have been the most challenging in my relationship that I’ve tried [00:24:00] to change about my husband have turned out to be the things that I have been able to look back and say, Oh, where’s my, that little Sharon is hurting for something that she didn’t get as a child. How can I now as the wise adult in this relationship that I have with my, my younger self, go back and give that to her rather than trying to pull on my husband to give it to me. And I know I’m not articulating this very well.

[00:24:29] It’s, it’s kind of a, uh, a very, what’s the word? It’s not a super concrete concept, but, you know, just as an example, I, I think I married someone outside of the church because I thought men who grew up in the church don’t respect the independence as, of women as much as men who didn’t. So my husband’s gonna really respect my independence and my Intelligence and all of that. And anytime I would see any sign that he didn’t, I would be like, Ahh, what did I miss? I missed a red flag, I married the wrong person. And, and I think every time, there are definitely times when you, you did miss a red flag and you did marry the wrong person. But I think for most of us, when you see that, oh, I missed a red flag,

[00:25:19] I married the wrong person, that’s the sign from the universe saying, this is something for you to work on within yourself. Can I stay grounded in myself, even when I have a husband who doesn’t just automatically value and appreciate everything about me? Can I value and appreciate everything about me as imperfect as I am so that my husband’s, you know, constant admiration and validation of me isn’t just a constant need. Um, but I can grow that in myself and stay, you know, grounded in that. Or we can have a difference about finances or, or some other issue and I don’t have to prove that I’m right. I can say, Oh, we have a different perspective on this, what are your values in this area? What are mine? And how can we figure out something that works for both of us?

[00:26:21] So I know those are kind of two very different examples, but I do think that those differences that we have, they’re opportunities for us to explore. You know, what’s, what’s a part of me that’s maybe still hurting that I need to give some attention to, or what’s an opportunity for us to create a new and better way that we’ve never explored before because we, we haven’t had this, this difference.

[00:26:48] Ed Watters: You know, it’s interesting. You said a lot of couples deal with this when we feel that [00:27:00] I did not marry the right person. I like to challenge that because I, I think when we have that type of feeling in a relationship, it’s, it’s more along the lines that we’re not receiving what we expect we should be receiving at the time, like you laid out. So those needs and those wants will make us act childishly and lash out because we’re not receiving those. But sometimes it’s one of the best things that can happen to us. So maybe those relationships that we run from all the time are the lessons that we need to learn the most. And therefore, you’ve got to stand your ground in a relationship.

[00:27:54] Because if you’re going to pack that baggage to the next person, as soon as they trigger the same emotional response from you, Well, that person’s not right for me. So I really don’t like to hear that. I like for people to really know who they’re marrying up front, ask these questions boldly, and then dive in and ride the roller coaster. It’s not easy, but it’s really fun. And that’s, that’s the point. Once we figure out that these things that we are going up and down together about, we’re doing them together. And I can tell you I need help for a lot of these roller coasters because my baggage that I packed in from my younger life is still there with my wife, and I don’t want that baggage to disrupt the joy that I have with my wife. So packing that baggage is really important for people to understand and learn to address because it’s something inside them. Because the person that you’re addressing this to or pointing at, well, they’re just doing what they always do.

[00:29:23] They’re the same person that you married, but for some reason, a smell, a sight, a sound triggered some fear response or emotional response, and now we don’t want to be there. So oftentimes we walk away and we miss the joy of that disruption that you find later in life, after you’ve built those emotional intelligence values up in yourself. And then we can [00:30:00] see, Oh, I’m so glad that I stuck it out. Even though it was so emotional and terrifying, I am so proud of myself that I could stick it out. I really don’t like baggage. What’s your, what’s your take on dragging your baggage with you?

[00:30:24] Sharon Costanzo: Uhh. Well, it’s so, um, it’s so easy to do. It’s so, like you were talking earlier, you were asking me earlier about, you know, just seeing kind of our weaknesses without, without hiding from them. I think it’s hard to recognize what is our baggage and what is not, you know, it’s hard to see just how I think like flawed and ineffective we can be in relationships because it’s all we’ve known, you know? We, um, I love doing the work that I do, especially as I kind of compare it to my kids who are eight and nine years old right now, because they’re in this developmental stage where they’re really like learning and exploring like what works and doesn’t work in relationships.

[00:31:20] How can I get what I want? What, you know, I, my two kids, they approach things so differently when they want something. My daughter just walks in and demands it, you know, and she’s such a good negotiator, it can be exhausting. But it’s so interesting and, and really delightful to see them figuring things out and to also reflect on, like, How did I learn how to cope in this imperfect world that we’re in? And, and then to, you know, become an adult and be like, Oh, you know, some of those coping strategies that I learned as a kid, you know,

[00:32:02] with kind of the, the harsh and critical home that I grew up in, some of those coping strategies that I have of being a really high achiever and being a perfectionist and, and all of those things, I really like that about myself a lot of times, and I also see how much harm it can have on my relationships when I don’t recognize that I have a choice. And when I don’t, um, you know, pause and take a breath, just like you’re saying, and like, is something really wrong here? Or am I just triggered? Um, so yeah, we, we do, we have so much, we, it’s so, yeah, just interesting to kind of think about, what is it in this moment that needs to be handled in the present? And how much of this is colored by [00:33:00] the pains of my past and how can I separate those and really just handle what needs to be handled right now?

[00:33:08] Ed Watters: That, that, that is key to every relationship. If, if we can identify our inner troubles about ourselves, it’s so much easier to be empathetic towards other people’s troubles that they’re dealing with. Because we’re all dealing with them, they’re there. And they’re going to pop

[00:33:29] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah.

[00:33:29] Ed Watters: and really, I don’t think it’s a bad thing. You’ve got to be able to feel confident and, you know, want to try to be different. And sometimes it just doesn’t kick off the way you think it’s going to. It’s just a thing, you know? So oftentimes we have to remember that, it’s just a thing. But life, it’s short and we’ve got to make the most out of it as quick as possible. And really that gets back to our underlying problem of communication. You gotta get the communication as quick as possible set in your relationship.

[00:34:17] Sharon Costanzo: Oh yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah. The, the better you’re able to learn to communicate, to be honest without being confrontational, to be patient while you figure some of these things out, um, the better off you’ll be for sure. For sure. And the other thing I talk about my, I talk about with my clients often is, you know, this work that we do, it’s not just for us. It really is a legacy that we create for our kids. And, um, it’s so powerful to be a part of changing the legacy of relationships. Um, and, and handing that legacy off to our kids and, you know, knowing that we’ve done, in good faith, we’ve done our best to provide them with a healthy framework for relating to other people.

[00:35:22] Ed Watters: Yes, it’s so important. That, that was laid out very well because that’s actually what we’re doing. We are bridge builders. There’s this cavern that we have to bridge that divide. So those young people coming forward, they don’t have that difficult crossing. And, and that’s what it’s truly about, educating the young. Because it’s triumphal when you get through it and you’ve learned to be happy with your relationship, your [00:36:00] life, where you are. And that’s not easy. It’s taken me, you know, almost sixty years now, and it’s a beautiful thing that I can relate with it. And not only relate with it, but want to pass that on. It’s so important. I think that’s why we’re here podcasting today. It’s beautiful, I really like it. What are you doing with your podcast? You have things that you work with couples about. Uh, I would really like to know the correlation between the work you do with your podcast and the work you do personally with couples.

[00:36:51] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well, a lot of times, you know, I, I’ll be seeing themes in the work I’m doing with, with couples and with individuals, kind of themes that I’ll address, um, in a, in a podcast episode. So my podcast, I do, I interview guests, which has been really interesting and enlightening to me to, to expand my perspective on relationships and how to create healthy, satisfying relationships. And then I do also share solo episodes to kind of really dive into some of these, what I would, what I would call these critical principles, um, for creating healthy relationships. So we do, we talk a lot about navigating conflict, we talk a lot about, um, kind of, really, how do you sit in the discomfort of all of it?

[00:37:47] And not lose, not lose it, is really a big part of it. I had a listener, like I, you know, like I mentioned, I, I do, I like to do a lot of local networking too. And, and one of the guys I met several months ago came up to me recently and he’s like, Thank you so much for your podcast. And, and it’s really changed my marriage and, and what I shared with you.

[00:38:09] And he’s like, Just being able to sit in the mess and see, you know, see my own part in my relationships has been very transformational. And so I, I do think I do a pretty good job at outlining, outlining, this is how you’re, you know, this is how you’re getting in your own way of getting what you want in a compassionate way.

[00:38:37] And this is what you can do about it. And that’s what I’m really proud about with the podcast is, it’s optimistic, it’s hopeful. Um, it’s also, I’m, I’m a pretty direct, I call it like I see it. So we’re not, we’re not dancing around offering these fluffy platitudes. We’re really talking about the nitty gritty [00:39:00] of relationships and, and conflict and, and how to make sense of it all and, and bring your best to it.

[00:39:09] Ed Watters: Yep. I like that a lot. You know, platitudes will get you nowhere. And, you know, being direct is truthful and truth will set you free. That’s the beauty of finding that openness of truth. Because those little white lies to skirt a confrontation, it’s not worth it. I can tell you 100 percent, be truthful up front.

[00:39:40] Get your needs met the way you feel that they need to be met, and that limits the confrontation. There is a person out there for you, don’t dive at the first one thinking it’s the best you can do. Get to know the person and see if that’s a good fit. It’s really one of the difficulties in our world today.

[00:40:06] We want to just be like everything else in our world, disposable. You know, throw it away, grab a new one. That’s not meaningful and you’ll never find true happiness doing that. The partner you’re with, especially if you’ve been with them more than two years, is probably the one you’re meant to be with.

[00:40:29] You know, you’ve got to figure that out within yourself. And, and each, each case is different, every relationship is different. So the big key is we have to be able to communicate and ask for help when we need it. What’s your take on asking for help when you need it? And, and bigger than that, what’s the sign of knowing when you need help?

[00:40:59] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah. Well, I think that’s so important and I think most of us wait too long. There’s so much kind of shame around that issue of, of getting, for getting help. And there’s also a lot of disappointment, like when you reach out for help and you get terrible help, like that, it does happen. I, I’ve experienced it myself. But my rule of thumb is, you know, if you have a certain issue that keeps coming up in your relationship and you’re not able to handle it on your own, you’ve probably read a book or two and listened to some podcasts and you’re still not,

[00:41:36] you know, you’re still not making the progress that you would like, then that’s time to reach out and get some help. Um, find someone you can trust. I remember the best advice I ever got was, you know, my husband and I had seen a few couples counselors at this time, and I was going to my own therapist to try, and well, like the couples work we’re doing isn’t helping

[00:41:57] so maybe I can get my own therapist to help me [00:42:00] with boundaries or something. And she said, Find somebody who’s like a reasonable enough fit and go for twelve sessions. And that’s what we did. And some of the things we got from that therapist were helpful, other things weren’t. We, you know, we kind of muddled along and got more help along the way, but that’s part of it.

[00:42:24] I mean, we, one of the things I think about often is, you know, I went to college for five years to become an engineer and we treat, like, marriage help counseling and therapy like things should be fixed in two or three sessions with one person. And you might need in the course of your marriage, you’re going to need multiple mentors.

[00:42:49] You’re going to need to learn from multiple people, and you’re going to need to learn more than two or three hours at a time of, it takes time. It takes dedication and commitment. And if you’re committed to having a long term satisfying, meaningful relationship, and you’re not there right now, and you can’t figure out why, and everything that you’ve tried has not worked, then get some help. Um, because there is help out there, and I think it’s worth it, um, to keep trying.

[00:43:30] Ed Watters: Big, I like that a lot. Uh, I could, I could go on for hours with you because I feel the need and the importance of this type of conversations. And I really appreciate that. Uh, Sharon, do you have a call to action for people? And could you let people also know how to get in touch with you and the services that you want to provide for the people?

[00:44:00] Sharon Costanzo: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I would say, like, the best way to get in touch with me is to just go to my website, respectedandconnected.com. And that’s where you can find my podcast, you can find the links to listen to my podcast, which is also called Respected and Connected. Um, You can schedule a consult call with me if you’re interested, you know, if you’re one of those people who’s like, ahh, I’m stuck, I’m frustrated, I don’t know what else to do. Um, schedule a free call with me and we can kind of talk through what’s going on and see if working together, um, in a, in a private coaching arrangement is a good fit. Um, I also do, like I said, I offer those group couples calls and, and that’s all on my website at respectedandconnected.com.

[00:44:48] Ed Watters: And do you have a call to action or a piece of wisdom for our listeners today?

[00:44:54] Sharon Costanzo: The call to action, I would say, Just be [00:45:00] willing to, just like we talked about, be willing to see more of yourself, to, to admit that you don’t know what you don’t know. Um, even if you’ve been trying really hard for a long time. A lot of people come to me and they think their partner must be the problem because they have done everything they can think of. Um, and it’s at that point, I think, it’s time to, to kind of soften your heart and humble yourself a little bit and be like there might be something about how I’m coming across in this relationship that I, I haven’t recognized and seen yet. And to be willing to see it, is going to be transformational.

[00:45:48] Ed Watters: Yeah, that’s big. Sharon, you’re a superhero. That, that hard truth is what couples need most of all. I want to say thank you for being here today, sharing your story and your expertise with us on the Dead America Podcast.

[00:46:07] Sharon Costanzo: Thank you.

[00:46:11] Ed Watters: Thank you for joining us today. If you found this podcast enlightening, entertaining, educational in any way, please share, like, subscribe, and join us right back here next week for another great episode of the Dead America Podcast. I’m Ed Watters, your host, enjoy your afternoon wherever you might be.