Jim Marshall

Jim Marshall

Jim Marshall: [00:00:00] Okay. First of all, I just wanna correct one thing, you refer to it as a simple book. I don't think that would be an accurate description of this book. Uh, uh, first of all, as I've told everybody, as I state in the book, this is an introductory text on a new subject. Um, the biggest problem with this book is getting people to read it, and I'll tell you why,

uh, most people don't read books. Of the people who do read books, most of them read fiction books. Of the people who read nonfiction books, most of them are in a slot, meaning, psychologists read psychology books, mathematicians read mathematics books, historians read history books, and so forth. This book does not fit into any established subject.

Uh, you can go to any university, anywhere on Earth, and you will not find any place that this fits in. All of those subjects fit into this, this is a comprehensive analysis of human phenomena.

Ed Watters: To overcome, you must educate. Educate not only yourself, but educate anyone seeking to learn. We are all Dead America, we can all learn something. To learn, we must challenge what we already understand, the way we do that is through conversation. Sometimes we have conversations with others, however, some of the best conversations happen with ourself. Reach out and challenge yourself. Let's dive in and learn something right now.

Today we are with Jim Marshall. He is the author of Septemics: Hierarchies of Human Phenomena. Jim, could you please introduce yourself, let people know just a little bit about your background, please?

Jim Marshall: Okay, thanks, Ed. Uh, I am the discoverer of hitherto unknown phenomena, which greatly aid in the understanding of people.

I am the inventor of a revolutionary, practical philosophic system called septemics, and I'm the author of the book You just cited, Septemics:, Hierarchies of Human Phenomena. This book would dramatically improve the life of anyone who takes advantage of it. If you'd like to find out about septemics, go to septemics.com, that's S, E, P, T, E, M, I, C, S.

As for my qualifications, I'm a polymath intellectual whose areas of expertise include psychology, philosophy, theology, parapsychology, engineering, science, mathematics, law, literature, history, metaphysics, military science, political science, physical culture, education, organization, and music. And I hold a Bachelor of science, cum laude from City University of New York.

Ed Watters: Well, Jim, that is definitely a polymath. And, uh, for people that don't know what a polymath is, it's the study of everything basically, or many subjects. Uh, what, what got you into being polymathic?

Jim Marshall: Actually, in retrospect, I was a born polymath. I have no memory of a time in my life when I was not intensely inquisitive about every subject that's taught in every university on Earth. Uh, I was shocked at the age of 10 to find out that some kids didn't like school,

that was incomprehensible to me. Uh, so I was searching even as a child, now I did not know what I was searching for, but eventually it led me many decades later to what I call septemics.

Ed Watters: So you, you came up with this, uh, program, septemics, and it consists of seven levels or seven life event levels, and then 35, uh, scales that identify where you are on this level.

Jim Marshall: Well, let me explain it to you this way, septemics is a philosophical science based on the fact that many phenomena related to human beings occur in a sequence of seven levels. Literally the word septemics means, of or pertaining to seven. Septemics comprises the collection of [00:05:00] scales or sequences, each of which breaks down various human phenomena into a hierarchy of seven steps.

There are 35 set scales which span the spectrum of human experience. By which I mean, there is no situation that's going to arise in the life of a human to which one or more of these scales does not apply. There are 24 scales which apply primarily to individuals, and 11 which apply primarily to groups.

Ed Watters: That's, that's kind of interesting. How did you stumble upon this? Or did you, were you taught about these things in different areas? How did you come up with it?

Jim Marshall: Okay, by the time I had my bachelor's degree, I knew several things. One was that although I was an engineer, I did not particularly wanna engineer electrons, or air foils, or other inanimate objects.

I wanted to engineer the human psyche, eventually this led me to becoming a human development engineer. And I had a long career of helping people to become more able. I made the intelligent, more intelligent, the industrious, more industrious, the ethical, more ethical and so forth. And I worked with hundreds of clients over many decades.

And as I was doing this, I started to observe that my clients would improve in predictable ways. Now, I never told this to anyone, but I made notes and after a while I had all of these scales of varying lengths and I had actually observed people going up these scales. Now, as I developed these scales, which again, nobody knew about but I, and I observed them in action. Uh, it was

undeniable to me that these were scales because I would know the result the client was going to get before the client got it, uh, because I knew the scale. Now, of course, there were many of them because there were many axes against which to develop a person. Now, I had one scale in particular that I absolutely knew was correct.

It had six levels, and in 1995, I discovered a seventh level for that scale. When I inserted that seventh level into the six level scale, it manifested mathematically. And I immediately saw that this was a natural function, meaning to say, this scale was something that existed independent of whether or not anybody knew about it.

It was, had nothing to do with my opinion. I observed it and when it mathematic, mathematically manifested, I saw that it had the kind of, uh, validity as per, you might say, compared to the pythagorean theorem. The pythagorean theorem was true before Earth existed and will still be true after Earth no longer exists. It's embedded into the fabric of the universe, okay?

It's natural law, these scales, each of them is natural law. Now, when I saw that one scale mathematically manifest, I asked myself, I wonder how many of these other scales that I have of varying ones are actually seven level scales that I just didn't fully develop. And because I knew what I was looking for, I was able to find the remaining levels on all these other scales.

And in a matter of weeks or months, I had about 32 scales. This is in 1995. And they all manifested mathematically when they had seven levels. So I realized that this was big, uh, and this was, wasn't something I was even looking for but this was something that was really big because by virtue of the fact that it's natural law, it rings true.

When people read these they say, yeah, that's right, I've been seeing this. So I then made the first transcript of the book, uh, which in early 96 I passed around to colleagues of mine, all of whom were brilliant men with graduate degrees, and somewhat to my surprise, they were all blown away by this. Now, when I say blown away, I don't usually speak that way.

That is what people tell me, people will read my book and say, wow, this blew me away. That is the most common response I get. But I have to tell you that beginning from day [00:10:00] one, early 96, the response to this material was universally positive. Every single person who has read this book or discussed it in depth with me has had a very positive response.

And if you go to my website, you'll see that. We'll see what the readers have said, what people have written about it, what the reviews are, and so forth. So this was, uh, to me as an engineer exciting because I saw that I had an opportunity create, to create something that would be of use to anyone who wanted to improve himself or his life.

So I worked on this for 25 years, uh, researching it, validating it, redundantly validating it. There are 35 scales now each of which has seven levels. That's 245 different levels each of which had to be verified and expressed. Now, the beauty of these scales is they're laid out, each of them in what you might call a table, or a spreadsheet, or a matrix.

So when you look at it, all of this data jumps out at you and each aspect of it verifies all the other aspects of it. Uh, so the, the natural law aspect of it is embedded in the tables themselves. And just as a point of reference, because I've been asked this many times, the closest thing to these scales is the periodic table of elements of chemistry.

Now, before Mendeleev invented the periodic table, there was a chemistry. But he revolutionized it by taking all of the elements and putting them on one piece of paper in correct relation to one another. And of course, as the generations went by, we've added the other elements and now we're up to about 120 elements.

Each one of these scales is like that. When you look at the periodic table, you see the nature of chemistry. And if you understand the table, if you know all the symbology that's in it, uh, you get a full picture of chemistry. And each of these 35 scales, uh, gives you a clear picture of that area of human phenomena. For example, uh, I told you about this six level scale, which I then in 95, inserted a seventh level into.

That came to be called eventually, the scale of basic purposes. When you look at that scale, it is inarguable that it is the way it is because of the mathematics that's built into it. Two sides of an Isosceles triangle are necessarily equal by definition and that is true for each one of these scales.

Ed Watters: Yeah, that's interesting. You know, how you incorporated the table, the table actually lines everything up and explains what you're trying to do a lot better. You know, the elemental chart is outlined in a specific way. You say that this is revolutionary and it's beyond what people even think about right now. Your centuries ahead of modern science right now,

this is big in behavioral science. How, how did you get all of this into one simple book? And, and you say that it's laid out for the layman, you don't have to be an academic mind to actually understand what you are laying out here. How did you do that?

Jim Marshall: Okay. First of all, I just wanna correct one thing. You referred to it as a simple book, I don't think that would be an accurate description of this book. Uh, uh, first of all, as I've told everybody, as I state in the book, this is an introductory text on a new subject. Um, the biggest problem with this book is getting people to read it and I'll tell you why, most people don't read books. Of the people who do read books, most of them read fiction books. Of the people who read nonfiction books, most of them are in a slot meaning, psychologists read psychology books, mathematicians read mathematics books, historians read history books, and so forth.

This book does not fit into any established subject. Uh, you can go to any university anywhere on Earth and you will not find any place that this fits in. [00:15:00] All of those subjects fit into this. This is a comprehensive analysis of human phenomena. Now, notice I don't say human behavior because phenomena is a much broader area than behavior.

The, psychology is defined as a study of behavior, uh, and there's a lot in here that goes beyond behavior. It gets into all kinds of other phenomena. Now, I told you I was searching even as a child, and by the time I had my bachelor's degree, I pretty much knew, because I was such an attentive student, what the mainstream had to offer.

In other words, I knew about all the basic subjects , uh, that existed in the mainstream and there were huge gaps in between all of this data that were completely unaddressed by the mainstream. So then I studied a variety of alternatives, subjects to see what I could find out, and eventually all of that, uh, led me to become a skilled human development engineer.

And by working with clients, hundreds of clients, some of whom I treated for hundreds of hours over a period of many decades, this data just fell out in front of me. So I have been seeing this data now for almost 50 years because this data started appearing when I first started working on people. I started noticing it and after a while there was enough that I had to start writing it down.

And so there is a tremendous amount of verification on this, all of this is empirical. I have no theory, this is not a theory, this is simply a phenomenon that presented itself to me in the same way that the alternating current motor presented itself to Nicola Tesla. It just came to him in his mind, he just saw what it was and how it worked

and, uh, he built it. So there, there was no arguing that what he saw was correct because everybody in the world uses alternating current based on what he first invented or discovered. So as an engineer, I have an irrevocable commitment to the truth. And what I mean by that is, whatever I create must work.

That is how I'm able to, was able to be a successful human development engineer. The only thing I cared about was getting results from my clients, that's it and I did. And as I went forward and saw these scales in action, it became easier and easier for me and my skill became greater and greater because I knew exactly what level the guy was at and therefore what level he would go up to.

Now, one of the axioms of septemics is that you can never skip a level. It's just like if you're on the first floor of a building and you wanna go to the fifth floor. One way or another you have to go through the second, the third, and the fourth. Even if you go outside the building and climb up on a ladder, okay,

there's no getting around that. That is how these skills are, you can never skip a level. Now, sometimes it may appear that you skipped a level because you went through it quickly or easily, and in the case of certain skills that does happen. Uh, but it's an appearency, you never skip a level. Now, that's important because this solves one of the oldest dilemmas of humankind, which is the gradient problem.

You see, nobody can lose a hundred pounds, but you can lose one pound a hundred times. Every good coach, and facilitator, and teacher in the world understands gradients. A good teacher of anything will take you through the proper gradients, he's not just gonna throw you into something. I've worked as a trainer.

I'm not just gonna give a guy a hundred pounds, I'm gonna work with him for a while and see what he can do. How much can you curl with one arm? Maybe for some guy it's 20 pounds, another guy might be 30 pounds. And this is the key to training and to physical development to get the right gradient. You just can't take a person who's eating corn dogs and McDonalds

and make them a vegan, it doesn't work. You have to do it by gradients and each one of these scales is gradients. It takes you through this entire area of phenomena [00:20:00] and gives you the exact gradient so you know with precision what you're gonna get to if you improve and what you're gonna get to if you decay.

Now, if you like, I could read you the names of the scales and you'll see when I do that that this covers all of human experience.

Ed Watters: Yes, please do.

Jim Marshall: Okay, so I'm gonna read the 24 individual scales, so-called individual scales. Uh, and then I'll read the group scales. So the individual scales are, the scale of basic purposes, the scale of personal influence, the scale of choice, the scale of permeation, the scale of thought, the scale of identity, the scale of evaluation, the scale of motivation, the scale of control, the scale of stopping, the scale of scholarship, the scale of literacy, the scale of human ability, the scale of memory,

the scale of spiritual identity, the scale of mental deletion, the scale of aberration, the scale of physical fitness, the scale of justification, the scale of belief, the scale of equanimity, the scale of attack, the scale of conflict, and the scale of reaction. The group scales are, the scale of relationships, the scale of life spheres, the scale of government, the scale of civilization,

the scale of survival, the scale of management, the scale of exchange, the scale of communication, the scale of allegiance, the scale of sexuality, and the scale of politics. Now you have to realize that each of these 35 scales is unique. You cannot learn anything about scale A by studying scale B, you cannot learn anything about scale C by studying scale D.

Each one is unique and each one of 'them takes those 35 phenomena and puts it into a seven level gradient. And I explained in the book why it's seven, it's a mathematical explanation. So, uh, this makes it very easy for a person to utilize this information because each of these scales provides a user with an infallible way of determining the solitariness or beneficialness of any group, individual, or activity.

If the group, individual, or activity moves persons or groups up these scales, it's beneficial or positive. If it moves them down, it's detrimental or negative. More importantly, just finding out what level you, or another person, or some group is at is by itself enlightening and beneficial. And finally, once you know the actual level of a personal group, you can improve that person or group by moving them up one level at a time.

All of these advantages represent major steps forward for society. Each of these scales is an axis against which to evaluate human behavior. Combined, they empower one to understand, predict, and manage human affairs to a degree, either to, unattainable by most.

Ed Watters: Interesting. So, so those scales that you use, they measure all 35 of these, and then by those measurements of where you are on these 35 levels of scales, that tells you where you are on the seven levels of life. Can you outline what the seven levels of life are?

Jim Marshall: Well, first of all, as I said, every scale is unique, you can't really discuss the scales generally. You have to look at each scale, each scale stands on its own just as a periodic table does. Uh, so the, basically what it does is, it shows the actual gradients in that phenomenon. Like the scale of thought, there are seven levels of thought, okay. Now every,

Ed Watters: Ah, okay.

Jim Marshall: every human being is at some level on every scale. Furthermore, most of these scales are what I call specific scales, meaning they're applicable to specific areas. Let's take the scale of motivation, for example. You can find your motivation, but motivation in what context? You'll have one motivation toward your spouse, another motivation toward your son, another motivation toward your mother, another motivation toward your friend, another motivation toward your boss and so forth.

So you can find what is your motivation in all kinds of contexts. So you could just take that one scale and dramatically improve your life by figuring out your [00:25:00] motivations. Because when you know your motivation, it then becomes possible for you to improve your motivation up to a higher level, one level at a time.

More importantly, on this scale, if you know the motivation of another person, that's the key to understanding that person. You see, if the people of Germany knew Hitler's motivation, he, he never would've gotten 37% of the vote in 1933.

Ed Watters: Yeah.

Jim Marshall: They didn't know that. Moreover, if you look at the scale of basic purposes, Hitler's basic purpose, he's at the lowest level, level seven, which is the purpose to destroy.

Now, some people have trouble understanding this because they, they don't get the idea that there are people who intend to destroy. Most people sort of get the idea that the destruction is sort of a side effect. And in many cases that's true, but not for people at the bottom of the scale. If you study Hitler or Pol Pot, which I have, you can see that they did horrendously destructive things, destructive to their own interests, destructive to their own militaries, destructive to their own countries. And if the people of Germany had this book, he never would've gotten 37% of the vote.

He would've gotten some votes, you know who would've voted for him? Psychopaths, sociopaths, crazy people, corrupt people. Uh, so he would've gotten maybe 20% of the vote at most because that's how many people there are that, you know, in the electorate that cover those categories. But he never would've gotten 37%. And the Nazis would've remained as they had been before, a fringe group.

Ed Watters: Yeah, interesting. Yeah, it's, it's very interesting how you, uh, how you dissect each section of our life. You know, it's like you, you take each behavior and you dissect it.

Jim Marshall: Yes. And again, I wanna say this goes way beyond behavior. For example, as I mentioned, there's a scale of civilization, okay?

The scale of civilization is completely beyond the purview of psychology. It describes how civilizations develop. Now, when I civil, say civilization, I don't mean society because there are societies that are not civilized. As far as I'm concerned, there is no earth civilization. There are subgroups on Earth,

particular groups that are groups of civilized persons, but Earth is not a civilized planet. But there has, have been, uh, civilizations that have developed at various times and usually fell just as the United States is currently collapsing. Uh, if you study Spengler, uh, which I did, uh, I do make the point that

his work is somewhat similar to mine. Uh, now he was working on empires, these cycles of empires. And he came up with a thesis, which if you study it, is, is inarguably correct that every, uh, empire, and he goes through the four main empires, every empire has a spring, a summer, a fall, and a winter. The United States is now in

either the fall or the winter, okay, it's certainly past the summer. So, uh, what you have to appreciate is, this book can save you a fantastic amount of catastrophe, disaster, heartache. Knowing the data in this book can save you from bankruptcies, from divorces, from being cheated, all the bad things that happen to people can be forestalled by a knowledge of this book.

And I can tell you, when I was a young man, I was like everyone else. I didn't know this data, it didn't exist. And so I made the same mistakes everyone else makes, getting involved with people I never should have been involved with. Now if you know this book, it is an eye opener in that you can, you can look at a person and evaluate 'them just like that.

For example, I know the basic purpose of every president of the United States going back as far as Franklin Delano Roosevelt. I also know the basic purposes of some of the earlier presidents who I studied, like Lincoln, Jefferson, and Washington. Uh, and the reason I, uh, know the people since Roosevelt is, all of them have been presented very much in the media. Radio,[00:30:00]

television, and print, and so forth. So it's not hard to look at somebody who's in the, in the media

Ed Watters: Yeah.

Jim Marshall: and evaluate him against any one of these scales. So I will not tell you what levels they're at, because in the first place, I will never give the level of any living human being. I say in the book, don't tell someone his level, even if you're sure

you know what it is. Help him to find it himself. Then he will have an epiphany and he will realize that this works and he will use it to straighten out his life, which is the purpose of this book. I wrote this book to help people and I have jumped from helping people by the hundreds to helping people by the millions through this book.

Ed Watters: Yeah, I appreciate that. You know, I've noticed, I've had, uh, polymathic people on before and they all love to help educate other people. Uh, I appreciate that about you. So what is the number one thing that you want people to take away from this book?

Jim Marshall: Well, I don't know that there is, I can give an answer to that question.

I do invite everyone to go to the website septemics.com and look at it. You can see what readers have said about it, you can see what people have written about it, you can see reviews, and you can even read sections of the book. And if you wanna contact me, my contact information is there also. That will be the first step.

And, uh, what I tell all of my students and clients is, study this book the way we would study any textbook, a chemistry text, a math text, economics text, start on page one and go through. Now I give glossaries not only for every chapter, even for the introduction, there is a glossary. So I am helping people with the semantic barriers that they might run into and thereby making this comprehensible.

Now, you asked me a question earlier that I didn't get around to answering. One of the reasons that I worked on this book for 25 years is, I was determined to make this a gift to the people of Earth, not to the intelligentsia. So I have a difficult subject and I went through it word by word, literally word by word, a 87,000 word book,

looking at each word and saying, is this the best word to use here? How will the average reader interpret this word? So I spent a lot of time writing it in a way that would be comprehensible to anyone who can read English reasonably well. Now, I do wanna tell you that I have been involved in pedagogy, by which I mean teaching and learning, since the age of three

continuously. So I have a lot of experience in how to teach and how to learn. And all of that went into this book to take this material, which is a completely new subject, and express it in a way that people will get. And the response has been overwhelmingly positive, people get it. I succeeded in communicating this in a way that the average reader would say, yes.

That's what people say when they read this. They read some chapter and they say, wow, yes, that's right. I've seen this, this is what happens and they get it. And the fact that I did extensive research on each of the 35 scales made it possible for me to express it in a, a table or a spreadsheet. So that when you look at it

and just study that one table, you see all the implications of the scale. They jump out at you, uh, as to what this is really about and why it is the way it is. Uh, and I can tell you, uh, you know, as an engineer, engineers are only interested in facts. We are not interested in opinions. You know, if I have to put a bridge across the river and you tell me, well, I think it's about a mile wide, that does not help me at all, okay.

Ed Watters: Yeah.

Jim Marshall: I'm gonna go out there with a laser beam and I'm gonna measure that and, and get down to a 10th of an inch, how far it is across this river. That is how I approached this book and I spent 25 years doing this. So there were two problems, first, I had to discover the phenomena, then I had to create septemics, and then I had to express it in a way that people would get, and that's [00:35:00] happening.

I've watched the results of this for 25 years and after seeing the 25 years of positive results, I finally published it. That was a little over a year ago.

Ed Watters: You know, it's, it's very interesting that you bring up, your mindset is so specific, I want a 10th of an inch on that river measurement. You know, and that tells people a lot about who you are and how you think.

A lot of people don't understand, Jim actually graduated early and he, he actually excelled above the average person. So when he dives into something, you know that he's going for that 10th of an inch measurement on something vast and wide. Where most of us, well, it's about the, you know, it's something to highlight when you want to illustrate

how good a book is going to be. And I think when you have a polymathic mind and an approach to a scientific nature of a book, that's always gonna be a good read. How can people find the book, Jim?

Jim Marshall: Well, I'll tell you, if you, if you type the word septemics in any search engine, you'll get a vast number of responses, including all the people who are selling the book.

So it's S, E, P, T, E, M, I, C, S. Now I wanna say it's in hard bound, soft bound, and ebook. The ebook is very inexpensive, as are most eBooks. So for a minimal investment that anyone can afford, a person on minimum wage can afford this book. And I went through a lot of trouble over a 25 year period to make sure that everything you needed is in the book.

The only thing you might need that's not in the book is a dictionary, but that goes for every book. If you're gonna read Dostoevsky or Thomas, Modern Dickens, I would recommend having a dictionary handy so that you know what he's saying. And I, I say that for any subject, including this one. But beyond that, everything is in the book, including very specific instructions on how to study the book, how to master the subject, how to use it to improve your life, how to use it to improve other people's lives.

Everything is laid out very clearly. So if you actually understand the words that are used in the scales and used in the text, you will get it and you will be able to use this to improve your life and the lives of persons around you. I recommend to all of my personal contacts, first, study the book starting from the beginning to the end, just the way you would study any textbook and a course.

Then go back to the beginning, read it again, and then on the second reading, find your level on every scale. If you do that alone, by the time you finish the second reading, you will be a new and better person. Because it will have opened your eyes to what you are doing, what you have been doing, what's going on around you.

Now, the other thing I can tell you is that anybody who masters this book will have an impact on society. And again, I've been watching this for 26 years now. Because what's gonna happen is if you comprehend this book, you're going to improve yourself. But then necessarily, you are going to want to use it on the people around you.

If you have a son who's having difficulty in school, there is a scale of scholarship. You can use that chapter to help him to resolve his scholarship difficulties. Uh, if you have somebody who has literacy problems, there is a scale of literacy. You can help the person find their level and then move them up one level.

So, uh, people who master this book will have an impact on society. Because they're not just gonna help themselves, they're gonna help 10, or 20, or 30, or 40 people. And then those people will tend to get the book and use it on themselves and they will help other people. So there will be a ripple effect. So that's what I'm trying to do,

I'm trying to get this book in use as widely as possible so that people can improve their lives. And when I say improve their lives, I mean by your standards of improvement, not mine. There is no evaluation in this book. I'm not telling you what your goal should be, how you should act, I'm telling you, this is the phenomena and you are somewhere in this

list of seven levels. [00:40:00] And if you find that it will clarify your mind and then you'll be able to move up a level which will make you a more capable and more successful person.

Ed Watters: That's very fascinating and I don't know how you did it. But it is very remarkable and I'm definitely going to get the book and check it out myself. How can people get ahold of you, Jim, and find out where you are?

Jim Marshall: Well, my contact information is on the website, septemics.com , uh, you can send me an email. Uh, but more importantly, I mean, I'm happy to respond to emails, but more importantly, I'd advise you to get the book and invest some time in it because it will change your life.

Uh, and that's, that is an universal response I'm getting from people. I mean, I've had people, people with doctorates from MIT and all kinds of other Universities looking at this and saying, wow, there's a massive amount of data. Now, you said a minute ago that you wondered how I'd figure this out, I'll tell you how I'd figure it out.

It fell out in front of me as a result of my helping people, helping hundreds of people for many decades. As I said, I just observed these phenomena in my clients and I simply wrote them down. And I told you in 95, I had this epiphany where I had this one, 6 level scale and when I put the seventh level in, it manifested mathematically.

And then when I looked at all the other scales to see if they were seven level scales, they all manifested mathematically. And then I realized that I had found something. Now, the reason I found this is, A, because I spent most of my life helping people. And so this is a book to help people. Now you might say everyone wants help, and that's not true.

There are many people who are not interested in improving themselves,

Ed Watters: That's right.

Jim Marshall: not interested in helping others. There are people who are destructive. There are, there are many criminals. About 20% of the population is essentially criminals, okay? They don't wanna improve themselves. They want money, they want pleasure, and if you get in their way, they'll kill you, or blackmail you, or whatever. Whatever suits their purpose.

Ed Watters: I agree.

Jim Marshall: They're not interested in, in helping themselves, they don't have insight. You see, the common denominator to downscale people is that they lack insight. So in terms of septemics, you have upscale and downscale cause there are 35 scales. Now there are very few people who were at or near the top of all of these scales, very few.

Uh, there is a larger number of people who are at or near the bottom of these scales, but most of us are in the middle. And I have done complete analyses of people, a complete septemic analysis of actual people I knew and put it in the back of the book. Now, I didn't give any names, I didn't even give the gender.

I just called them subject one, two, and three. And I went through all 35 scales with that actual person and gave a full evaluation of what, and if you read that, you will see how people are high on one scale and low on another scale. For example, uh, I have always been interested in, uh, STEM subjects, science, technology, engineering, mathematics, and still am. And I'm still, uh, educating myself on that because of course, science advances. So, If you listen to these brilliant mathematicians and scientists, most of them don't know English very well.

You know, I had a client who was a doctor, a successful doctor, and just socially, I read a novel that I liked very much, and just socially, I said, here, read this novel, it's, it's, it's great. So she said, okay. So I saw her like a week or two later and she handed me back the book and she said, and I quote, I can't read this book.

Now we're talking about a doctor, a successful doctor could not read a popular novel. So there is a scale of literacy. And as I point out in the book, there are millions of people with graduate degrees who are not terribly literate. Now, most people think in terms of, well, either you're literate or illiterate, and that's not true.

There are seven levels of literacy just as there are seven levels of all these other things. Frankly, you can take any one of these skills at random and dramatically improve your life. But why do that? Because there are 35 scales, there are 35 different ways for you to improve yourself. And if you find your, just find your level on all 35, you will undergo a metamorphosis.

And that is what I want, I want people who want to improve to have a way to improve. And this does not put you at the mercy of teachers, [00:45:00] or professors, or anybody else. It's you and the book. And so I advise you, get the book and use it.

Ed Watters: Well, that's, that's a powerful call to action, Jim. I wanna say thank you for sharing all of this with us and we had a great time talking with you.

Jim Marshall: Thank you, Ed. It was a pleasure.

Ed Watters: Thank you for joining us today. If you found this podcast enlightening, entertaining, educational, in any way, please share, like, subscribe, and join us right back here next week for another great episode of Dead America Podcast. I'm Ed Watters your host, enjoy your afternoon wherever you may be.

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